Comments on: An Afternoon in Ramallah http://rabbibrant.com/2008/01/18/an-afternoon-in-ramallah/ Random Blogthoughts by Rabbi Brant Rosen Tue, 02 Dec 2008 00:49:40 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=MU hourly 1 By: aaa http://rabbibrant.com/2008/01/18/an-afternoon-in-ramallah/#comment-2844 aaa Tue, 22 Jan 2008 13:29:27 +0000 http://shalomrav.wordpress.com/2008/01/18/an-afternoon-in-ramallah/#comment-2844 One has to wonder how a Palestinian (or any other)nationalist can challenge the concept of "identity politics." While Dr. Ashrawi is a respected voice in the west, in terms of Palestinian nationalism and the Palestinian nationalist movement, she appears to be another in a long line of failed politicians (we've got more than our share of those as well.) In her role as an Arafat aide/advisor, she did not bring her people to peace or even a "partial" state. As a human rights activist -- the mission which she tried to recreate for herself -- she did little to reform or increase human rights within the PA. And as a non-Muslim, she has done little to stop the increasing Islamist disrimination within the PA and the areas. She has done little to make it a secular state. One could argue that through her silence, she has played a role in making it worse. Like many politicians in that region, she may be an effective spokesperson toward the west, but I'm not sure she's a leading voice there. While Prime Minister Fayed apparently made some reference to Palestinian confidence building measures toward Israel and Israelis, I didn't see any such reference from Dr. Ashrawi in either Rabbi Rosen or Ms. Freeman's comments. Again, thanks very much to you and the members of your group for bringing us the range of views that you gained on your trip. One has to wonder how a Palestinian (or any other)nationalist can challenge the concept of “identity politics.” While Dr. Ashrawi is a respected voice in the west, in terms of Palestinian nationalism and the Palestinian nationalist movement, she appears to be another in a long line of failed politicians (we’ve got more than our share of those as well.) In her role as an Arafat aide/advisor, she did not bring her people to peace or even a “partial” state. As a human rights activist — the mission which she tried to recreate for herself — she did little to reform or increase human rights within the PA. And as a non-Muslim, she has done little to stop the increasing Islamist disrimination within the PA and the areas. She has done little to make it a secular state. One could argue that through her silence, she has played a role in making it worse.

Like many politicians in that region, she may be an effective spokesperson toward the west, but I’m not sure she’s a leading voice there. While Prime Minister Fayed apparently made some reference to Palestinian confidence building measures toward Israel and Israelis, I didn’t see any such reference from Dr. Ashrawi in either Rabbi Rosen or Ms. Freeman’s comments.

Again, thanks very much to you and the members of your group for bringing us the range of views that you gained on your trip.

]]> By: Rabbi Brant Rosen http://rabbibrant.com/2008/01/18/an-afternoon-in-ramallah/#comment-2837 Rabbi Brant Rosen Sun, 20 Jan 2008 09:25:44 +0000 http://shalomrav.wordpress.com/2008/01/18/an-afternoon-in-ramallah/#comment-2837 Yes, indeed, that was a powerful aspect of our discussion and one I think Anna described very well. I think that part of our discussion with Ashrawi challenged many of us to examine our preconceptions about nationalism and identity as Americans and Jews. At the same time, I thought she was remarkably open to hear some members of our group when they discussed their vision of Zionism - one that is based Jewish peoplehood, one in which there is a true separation of religion and state and one that truly extends equal rights to all its citizens At the end of the day, Ashrawi told us Israel's insistence on the recognition of their "right to exist as a Jewish state" is somewhat moot in the current circumstances. In essence, her messsage was "Israel exists as a Jewish state whether I like it or not. It's clearly not going away, so let's see if we can find a way for our two nations to live in two side by side states before it's too late..." Yes, indeed, that was a powerful aspect of our discussion and one I think Anna described very well. I think that part of our discussion with Ashrawi challenged many of us to examine our preconceptions about nationalism and identity as Americans and Jews. At the same time, I thought she was remarkably open to hear some members of our group when they discussed their vision of Zionism - one that is based Jewish peoplehood, one in which there is a true separation of religion and state and one that truly extends equal rights to all its citizens At the end of the day, Ashrawi told us Israel’s insistence on the recognition of their “right to exist as a Jewish state” is somewhat moot in the current circumstances. In essence, her messsage was “Israel exists as a Jewish state whether I like it or not. It’s clearly not going away, so let’s see if we can find a way for our two nations to live in two side by side states before it’s too late…”

]]> By: Lesley Williams http://rabbibrant.com/2008/01/18/an-afternoon-in-ramallah/#comment-2836 Lesley Williams Sun, 20 Jan 2008 07:02:03 +0000 http://shalomrav.wordpress.com/2008/01/18/an-afternoon-in-ramallah/#comment-2836 I'm surprised you didn't mention Ashrawi's comments on the very nature of Israel. The following is from Anna Freedman's account of your meeting: http://btvshalom.org/resources/brit_tzedek_20080117.shtml Finally, Dr. Ashrawi expressed her general dislike for nation-building on the basis of identity politics. Specifically, this would mean defining a state solely by one or more characteristic of its people, including race, religion, or ethnicity. She posits that any state, Israel included, should be a state for all its citizens. This statement really called into question the idea of a Jewish state, and elicited a strong emotional reaction from some members of our group. The question called up in me a very difficult question: In a nation where the separation of church and state is written into the First Amendment of our constitution, how can we, as Americans, also be Zionists, believing in the legitimacy of Israel as a Jewish state? I’m surprised you didn’t mention Ashrawi’s comments on the very nature of Israel. The following is from Anna Freedman’s account of your meeting:
http://btvshalom.org/resources/brit_tzedek_20080117.shtml

Finally, Dr. Ashrawi expressed her general dislike for nation-building on the basis of identity politics. Specifically, this would mean defining a state solely by one or more characteristic of its people, including race, religion, or ethnicity. She posits that any state, Israel included, should be a state for all its citizens. This statement really called into question the idea of a Jewish state, and elicited a strong emotional reaction from some members of our group. The question called up in me a very difficult question: In a nation where the separation of church and state is written into the First Amendment of our constitution, how can we, as Americans, also be Zionists, believing in the legitimacy of Israel as a Jewish state?

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